Ace!
So Oregon
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It's been over two full months since I took my Fleetwood E3 into the dealership for them to document the damage to my roof. I got a call this morning that the warranty was approved by FTCA.
Now the fun part, I've been told since it's not the first year of the warranty I'll have to pay $1800 for crating/shipping the roof. I asked if the roof could be shipped with another product but was told they are not currently ordering any new product from FTCA (makes sense since it's the end of the season), and she stated they tried to do that because they have a customer with the same issue but that FTCA took so long to approve the warranty that the other customer's roof was already approved and therefore cannot be shipped together (they can't make the other customer wait). I asked how long it will before mine ships and was told that the other customer is still waiting for her roof to ship and it's been six weeks since the warranty was approved and the customer paid the shipping costs.
So, here are my questions:
Does it seem appropriate that crating/shipping would be $1800 (I'm in Oregon, so west coast)?
Does it seem appropriate to have a two month wait before the warranty was approved by FTCA?
Does it seem appropriate that it may now take over six weeks to receive the roof (based on a customer with the same issue at six weeks no without an estimated date for receiving their roof)?
I've asked if I can have the documentation for the shipping to prove the total crating/shipping costs and asked if I will receive a refund of an overpayment if it's less than $1800. Does this seem appropriate to ask for this information from the dealer?
Do you think it is appropriate to contact FTCA directly to discuss delays in warranty approval, delay in shipping the roof and crating/shipping costs?
I just received a second call from the dealership stating the $1800 includes mark up, handling fees from the dealership, that the warranty includes labor only and therefore I am responsible for shipping fees as well as unloading/uncrating, handling while the part is at the dealership and the warranty includes the part price and labor only, no other costs associated with replacement. This does not seem appropriate to me.
Thanks for your input. I'm very frustrated with the process and also with the cost.
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Beacher
Long Beach, CA
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Ace! wrote:Does it seem appropriate that crating/shipping would be $1800 (I'm in Oregon, so west coast)?
Yes, that's sounds just about right.
Ace! wrote:Does it seem appropriate to have a two month wait before the warranty was approved by FTCA?
Yes, that sounds pretty normal. Much of that time has to do this your dealership's Service Manager. They can usually get an answer to a warranty claim within 24 hours. However being that the FTCA Coleman plant has had a bunch of labor and management issues over the past few months, (if they were even open for regular business), that's not surprising.
Ace! wrote:Does it seem appropriate that it may now take over six weeks to receive the roof (based on a customer with the same issue at six weeks no without an estimated date for receiving their roof)?
That kinda time frame was normal even when the economy was booming and the Coleman plant was operating as normal.
Regardless what your dealership tells you, they don't ship your lone roof across the country all by itself in the back of a freight truck. Besides regular manufacturing lead-time at the Coleman plant, they schedule it to be shipped with other PopUps and replacement parts. Your lone roof will be strapped upside down to a new PopUp for it's trip across the country.
Ace! wrote:I've asked if I can have the documentation for the shipping to prove the total crating/shipping costs and asked if I will receive a refund of an overpayment if it's less than $1800. Does this seem appropriate to ask for this information from the dealer?
Heh, that right there is funny. They, (Coleman and your dealership), simply charge that amount for a warranty roof repair. They can charge whatever they want to help recoup their actual manufacturing, transportation, and handling expense.
The only "discount" is if you arrange for a roof replacement at one of the two Coleman dealerships within 20 miles of the actual factory in PA. Only in that circumstance, they cannot justify "freight charges".
Ace! wrote:Do you think it is appropriate to contact FTCA directly to discuss delays in warranty approval, delay in shipping the roof and crating/shipping costs?
YES! If you can manage to speak to the actual people involved in your case, it will magically work faster. However, their contact system is built just like every other corporate manufacturing entity, it's not designed for contact with actual end-customers. It's up to you to be diligent enough to figure out how to get in touch with the "right" people.
Ace! wrote:I just received a second call from the dealership stating the $1800 includes mark up, handling fees from the dealership, that the warranty includes labor only and therefore I am responsible for shipping fees as well as unloading/uncrating, handling while the part is at the dealership and the warranty includes the part price and labor only, no other costs associated with replacement. This does not seem appropriate to me.
Read your warranty. It only covers the part price and labor.
Two months ago, when you first reported your issue to your dealership, was your PopUp still under the 1st year "Bumper to Hitch" warranty? If that's the case, then all expenses are covered, including shipping.
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mike4947
N. Syracuse, NY
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Well three years ago before gas prices went up shipping alone to the west coast area ran $1200-$1300 so with inflation and gas pricing $1800 sounds about right. As for the length of time it also is about right considering a new owner of the company, and build out of new 2010's. Your roof has to be added to the production schedule.
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red31
Bryan
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No, none of this seems appropriate.
Worse than FTCA is your dealer trying to prfit from this.
I'd shop around for another dealer.
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Ace!
So Oregon
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Joined: 05/23/2005
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Mike, since you responded and I'm hoping I still have your attention, does it seem appropriate for the dealership to add "markup" to the warranty work?
I called FTCA and they stated that the warranty provides for part/labor and shipping is on me. They gave me the total for shipping, $1595.67 and stated I owe nothing else toward the repair of the PUP.
I called the dealership and they stated they get 30% mark up, the $1800 they quoted was a "deposit" and that if it costs more or less I'd have to pay the difference or get a refund, but that whatever the total cost charged it would include 30% dealer mark up. So, my $1800 would likely be just over $2000 by the time the repair was completed if total cost is $1595.67(as quoted by FTCA) and when the dealership is done with repair they would request another couple hundred dollars. Also, I was told I can pay the 30% mark up or not it was my choice, to have it repaired, or not have it repaired. Seems to me if a warranty repair includes profit then it isn't a warranty at all, but a normal repair. What is a warranty if there are costs associated with it outside and on top of those outlined in the warranty language?
If the roof will be shipped upside down on another PUP then it won't come in until next year, as the dealership has already advised me they are not getting any additional Coleman products this year. I was also told by the dealer if it did come with another product the shipping costs could be split, but that it won't come that way, so there is no splitting of the shipping costs.
Am I just totally off base to think it's inappropriate for the dealership to have a 30% mark up paid by the consumer for warranty work that states I'm responsible for shipping. It's now shipping plus 30% mark up?
Edited to add: also, I don't have any documentation of how the mark up is derived as the dealership is not providing the information on what the 30% is based. It's 30% mark up on an undocumented figure. So, I can only base 30% on what I know of the shipping charges, but the dealership could base it on cost of the part (unknown because it's paid direct to the shop by FTCA), or the labor (unknown because it's paid direct to the shop by FTCA). So, I'm left with paying an $1800 deposit with an unknown balance. Seems wrong to me.
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mwebber78
Maine
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Joined: 08/07/2005
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No offense but here it goes - they were criminals when they were called Fleetwood and they are criminals under the new Coleman name.
To be honest, they have always made a great looking product but don't expect them to help with warranty items. They have done the same thing with the ABS roofs, ABS leaking front trunks, lift issues and axle bending issues.
For these many reasons I recommed other brands to friends. I suggest you contact your state's arm that handles consumer affairs (state attorney generals office in our state) and make a complaint seeking arbitration, especially if it was reported within your warranty period.
Michael 
2 DD's and my DW 
6 Acre's in Southern Maine
2009 Crossroads Cruiser CF31SB
2008 Chevy 2500HD LT 4X4
Camping Pictures
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Ace!
So Oregon
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Beacher wrote:
Read your warranty. It only covers the part price and labor.
Two months ago, when you first reported your issue to your dealership, was your PopUp still under the 1st year "Bumper to Hitch" warranty? If that's the case, then all expenses are covered, including shipping.
I did read the warranty. The difference between year one and year two through five is freight, based on the warranty language. So, based on what my dealership is saying is if the PopUp is under the 1st year "Bumper to Hitch" warranty the difference in cost is freight, and they get 30% mark up. That's not the same as "all expenses are covered, including shipping" because the dealership includes 30% mark up. My dealership does not cover all expenses, less freight for year two through five, so there's no reason to believe that during year one all expenses would have been covered.
Maybe I am way off base, but I bought a product that was supposed to be what it was, but was not supposed to have a roof that leaked. It does have a warranty covering the roof and as such it seems to me I should ultimately get the product I thought I bought (a PUP without a leaking roof), but in this case I should pay freight. That's the way I read the warranty, that they (FTCA) should make the PUP right, that I should be made whole, less freight. Not that I should be made whole, less freight and dealer mark up of 30% of an undocumented amount.
* This post was
edited 09/17/09 02:55pm by Ace! *
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mike4947
N. Syracuse, NY
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The factory only pays warranty on R & R of the roof. Any moving, uncrating, prep work dealers feel they can charge for as it's not implied as covered under the warranty, and they won't get rembused for it. This is a dealer problem, not a factory one.
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Ace!
So Oregon
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Thanks Mike, and I agree. After speaking with FTCA they seem to be handling things appropriately, based on the warranty wording.
I'm surprised that my dealership, which does not have a good reputation anyway (with the people I've talked to, maybe they're well liked by someone else), would want to make things more difficult. My wife and I bought our PUP when our children were very young and a couple years later now my wife wants a larger trailer. I still want a truck camper in about 10 - 12 years. Our local dealership is throwing away a next purchase, probably in the next 2 - 3 years and probably less than 10 years after that.
Maybe I'm wrong thinking it works for an RV dealership, but I know that R&R makes a car/boat repair shop money. I know a number of techs and most can R&R a part in almost half the time given "by the book". Seems making an additional profit, paid by the consumer, on a warranty repair is in bad form and poor customer service.
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Beacher
Long Beach, CA
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Ace! wrote:
..... Not that I should be made whole, less freight and dealer mark up of 30% of an undocumented amount.
Typically, they, (the manufacturer and/or your dealership) do not disclose a breakdown of what the "freight" charge actually is. They have no legal requirement to do so. The dealership's typically just quote one fixed price.
I understand your dilema, now that you do have two different "freight" amounts, and the nebulous 30% markup. In reality, the real-world freight charge would be more like $400 from coast to coast to ship a roof, including insurance. However, their replacement policy is designed for them to recoup the actual cost of manufacturing, shipping, handling, and installation of the roof, that's where those $1,500 to $1,800 prices are coming from.
At this point, I'd go to a different dealership and ask what they would charge. Your dealership is taking advantage of a warranty situation to create some cash flow.
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