fncampn
Gardnerville, NV
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txtowman wrote:add weight to the back of the trailer, reduces tongue weight and balances truck, 500 lbs should help, rear tanks?
Ding ding ding! We have a winner!  I have a 50 gallon black and gray tank behind the rear axle, with the black being closest to the rear. I'm not sure I would want to fill the black up though. No place to drain it at the house without a macerator pump. But the gray could be filled. That can easily be drained in to the street drain along the curb. I'm sure the water going out is cleaner than what would normally go in to the drain anyway.
I wonder how much weight will actually be unloaded from the tongue? The gray tank is mounted about 2 feet behind the rear-most axle. 50 gallons weighs around 450 lbs. so maybe 100? I guess I would have to measure it out and calculate it...
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'08 Ford F150KR Screw 5.4L LB Auto 3.73LS 4x4
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campercajun
Central Texas Hill Country
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You are "torquing" the front frame horns when you lower your trailer tongue onto the ball, in a downward direction. I wouldn't think that "torquing" the frame horns upward an equal amount, with a WD hitch and bars, would be any more damaging or destructive than not using a WD hitch is. But I freely admit, I'm not a FoMoCo engineer, and I don't know what effect torquing the frame horns in either direction would have on the "crumple zone" portions of the frame. I do know, though, that the "crumple zones" are designed to deflect and collapse upon sudden and severe rearward horizontal loads, not vertical ones.
Any chance your '07 F350 PSD is still available for purchase? Seriously, I would try lightening the front of the trailer or weighting the rear, trying a ball-mount with a higher rise, and using the WD bars, to see how that worked, before trying any of the more expensive alternatives, which also would include paving your driveway!
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campercajun
Central Texas Hill Country
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Mark, if your pickup can handle the load OK, if you need to put water in the black tank to help out, most campgrounds have a dump station that you could use before taking the trailer to it's campsite and setting it up. Before building our RV garage, which has water and sewer hookups in it, I always put 5 gallons of water in each waste tank after dumping and rinsing them at the park dump station, to let the water slosh and clean the tanks as I drove, and prevent any solids in the bottom of the black tank from drying out and becoming something similar to concrete. I always visited the dump station to dump the 5 gallons of water from each tank before driving to my campsite. If you have a campsite with full hookups, you wouldn't even need to use a dump station. Our favorite COE park has only water and electrical hookups, which inspired me to plumb water and sewer connections into our RV garage. I can rinse, flush, fill, and drain our tanks anytime now, and take as long as I choose to do it without anyone waiting on me.
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fncampn
Gardnerville, NV
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campercajun wrote:You are "torquing" the front frame horns when you lower your trailer tongue onto the ball, in a downward direction. I wouldn't think that "torquing" the frame horns upward an equal amount, with a WD hitch and bars, would be any more damaging or destructive than not using a WD hitch is. But I freely admit, I'm not a FoMoCo engineer, and I don't know what effect torquing the frame horns in either direction would have on the "crumple zone" portions of the frame. I do know, though, that the "crumple zones" are designed to deflect and collapse upon sudden and severe rearward horizontal loads, not vertical ones.
Another great point. But I suspect the upward forces generated by the spring bars would be a greater amount than the downward force of the tongue. It's worth a try though.
And I do agree that, from my basic mechanical engineering judgment, that the frame horns were indeed designed to collapsed in one direction only. At least logic would indicate so. But FoMoCo hasn't been the most logical recently. 
campercajun wrote:Any chance your '07 F350 PSD is still available for purchase? Seriously, I would try lightening the front of the trailer or weighting the rear, trying a ball-mount with a higher rise, and using the WD bars, to see how that worked, before trying any of the more expensive alternatives, which also would include paving your driveway!
Nah, the 1-ton is gone. I do miss her but not the tranny problems. She towed the TT very well but not very comfortably. I will certainly try your suggestions except for paving the driveway. $11K estimate to do 60' is a little steep for me. 
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desertmoose
Northern Nevada
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fncampm:
From one engineer in the Carson Valley to another, here's a different idea.
Weld up a dolly with three or four swivel wheels at the bottom and a trailer ball at the top. Mount a tongue on it that plugs into the front receiver. Of course the tongue will require a "hinge' to allow movement as the truck and trailer ride thru dips, etc.
Drop the trailer coupler on the dolly. All the load from the tongue is on the dolly. then using the tongue, push the dolly and trailer into place. No vertical load at all on the truck.
If you're lucky and can size the dolly right, when the trailer is parked, it will be level from front to back, and you can leave it sitting on the dolly.
Sam
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SoCalDesertRider
SanDiego, CA, USA
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Joined: 12/14/2003
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I like the dolly idea best, as far as the weight carrying is concerned. Only bad thing is, it's very difficult to back a trailer with a dolly between the truck and trailer. It's like backing double trailers, or backing a car being towed on a dolly. Can't back straight very far before all the pivots start jacknifing on eachother.
The hand operated motorized tug dolly is probly the best solution. Either that or hook the truck and trailer as normal on the rear hitch and back it in like most of us do.
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BurbMan
Long Island, NY
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Joined: 09/20/2001
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I would say that you are already overloading your front axle with the tongue weight, no way I would attempt to connect the WD hitch on the front. Personally don't see the advantage to using the front hitch. I would think with a little practice you could back it in easier. Same principle as backing the truck into a parking space....you get better turning leverage with the steer wheels at the back of the assembly, ie., the front of the truck when you are backing in. Seems to me you would lose maeuverability using the front receiver. I have a front receiver on my truck but have never used it to move the trailer.
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fncampn
Gardnerville, NV
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Thanks for the ideas guys. I like the dolly idea. I've seen a few that are designed for tow vehicles that cannot handle a lot of tongue weight yet still have the GCWR capacity to tow a heavy trailer. I just can't seem to find it online. It has 2 pneumatic tires and a suspension frame that mounts to the receiver. The tires take the tongue load and the suspension helps with the up/down movement of the TT/dolly and tow vehicle interface.
As far as backing in the trailer, I wish I had your skill SoCalDesertRider. With only 6" of clearance on each side of the TT, there is not much room for error.
BurbMan, you are right that I'm overloading the front axle, but it's only for about 60' and a minute or two. I'm pretty sure I wouldn't be damaging it by going over by 200 pounds for that short of time.
As for backing in versus using a front-receiver to push the TT in, I find it the TT is MUCH more maneuverable using the front of the truck. The TT responds much faster to small corrections making it considerably easier to work in tight confines. I have tried to back the TT in but became frustrated when I couldn't correct quickly enough. And it's much easier for me to see where I'm going when pushing the TT. In any other situation, I'm pretty good at backing, just not with so little clearance.
This weekend I will experiment with everyone's ideas (except maybe paving the driveway) and report back what worked and what didn't.
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BarneyS
S.E. Lower Michigan
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fncampn wrote:Thanks for the ideas guys. I like the dolly idea. I've seen a few that are designed for tow vehicles that cannot handle a lot of tongue weight yet still have the GCWR capacity to tow a heavy trailer. I just can't seem to find it online. It has 2 pneumatic tires and a suspension frame that mounts to the receiver. The tires take the tongue load and the suspension helps with the up/down movement of the TT/dolly and tow vehicle interface.
This may be what you are looking for.
Barney
2004 Sunnybrook 30FKS TT
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2002 Ford F250 Super Duty, 7.3L PSD
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fncampn
Gardnerville, NV
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That's the one! Thanks Barney. I just couldn't remember the name of it. I think this would be the best solution of all. Any one have experience with the HitchHog?
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